Kona: Sure. But if, Machiventa or any of the Melchizedeks would like to address the question is about the “TWO-YEAR SYLLABUS”. For the, I think it’s regarding the ascension process and that was some part of the Teaching Mission that I’m not familiar with. So, it would be helpful to be more clear what perhaps Machiventa is looking for. Because I have a background in working with children. I would be very interested in finding that syllabus and adapting it for children.

Daniel: Thank you. Okay Machiventa is here he will answer.

Machiventa: Good day my Friends. It is a wonderful occasion to be with you once more. And thank you for your questions. The question that you asked about the quote, SYLLABUS end quote. Is a vital one, an important one that we had hoped that you would bite into in time.

The mention of the “syllabus” was made many years ago, perhaps. Well over 10 years ago. So, it is just a fragment in this one’s memory. And of course, that memory is backed up concerning our work. In form that one a question arises then that information is brought forward.

“The syllabus exists in the Morontial Realm for the teachers who are coming to various planets. The syllabus is an actual document, that exists on the other side of the fence [so to speak]. It is part of the preparation and training program for individuals, celestials who are coming to this planet. As far as a syllabus existence in the material realm of Urantia and the Teaching Mission that does not exist. It exists only as you will go through the various lessons, hundreds of lessons over time [during your ascension career].”

That emphasize many of the positive attributes of the individuals who are ascending. You might begin first with examining as a search process of those elements of the beatitudes. And those elements of wisdom of relationships and so on. This may take you probably a year or 2 year project for you. As you find the materials and research the materials through the transcripts and the explanations of those topics

Is this clear so far? So, you’ll be looking for typical topics, and then you’ll be searching for content to back up those topics. Is that clear?

Jacques: Yes.

Machiventa: Yes, thank you. It’s clear to me that this does not answer your question. It does not fill in the blanks. This is what you would call an original search. On your part and it will be much as though you were going to write a paper to explain what is TRUTH. What are the levels of truth? What are the levels of, GOODNESS? And BEAUTY, so on.

So those would all be discussed. In the syllabus. There are approximately one moment. 98, of those topics to be found. This would be an extensive syllabus. Period. This is given to you as for your own work. Your own development and it would be a very essential part of the Family Learning Centers for sustainable nations, for example. It’s also the related to ETHICS and so on. Good BEHAVIOR must have rules for decision making. Therefore, these would be topics as well. Any questions so far?

Kona: Not at the moment. It’s food for thought for sure. Thank you, Machiventa, and I’ll work with one perhaps on the databases and the search possibilities. I appreciate that. We’ll have to start.

Machiventa: You may want to create an outline. And that would be shared. And through your new software process You could have that, as a stand-alone project that others couldn’t contribute to. Thank you.

Jacques: Thank you, Machiventa, Yes, Marthe ask your question.

2. What is the difference between the Teaching Mission and the Magisterial Mission?

Marthe: Thank you, Machiventa, that clarification was really useful. I have a second question, and that is if you could just please remind us of the difference between the Teaching Mission and the Magisterial Mission, especially in our ability to understand it. I’ve had an explanation that says the Teaching Mission is about the individual training for our own spiritual growth. And that the Magisterial Mission related to the work of our magisterial son Monjoronson is related to the work of Co-Creative Design Teams and social groups, for the transformation of society.

We just wanted to understand if that’s a correct understanding and if you could just explain to us how we should best understand that. Thank you.

Machiventa: Let me smack event. Let me put it in very simple terms. You’re correct on the Teaching Mission: it is a teaching and training of individuals too so that they could participate, and social programs, we go from the individual to the group to be able to work in a group.

You here are may consider yourselves in This team a part of, the Magisterial Mission. Because it concerned about the social evolution of a planet and the civilization. Therefore, there is a coordination, a melding of programs between the Teaching Mission and the Magisterial Mission. Eventually there will be many types of Design Teams working on various aspects of a group, civilizational living of nations and of clans and of tribes and families and so on.

These are both efforts concerned about the social maturity that is the foundation for spiritual evolution. The Teaching Mission does teach social skills and spiritual skills. So, it is a broad-minded program. Thank you.

Jacques: Thank you Machiventa for that clarification, thank you.

Marthe: Yes, thank you. That was enlightening. Are there any questions from anyone at this point?

Jacques: Yes, Kona please proceed.

Kona: Yes, thank you, Machiventa. And, just to clarify upon what you’re saying because I know that our group especially with Mission [Urantia group], we’re caught between discerning. Sharing information on deepening our spiritual beings and sharing, you know, sharing with others on how to deepen their spirituality with stillness and whether or not we are an organization promoting social sustainability, or both at the same time. And so, it seems based on your comment that it is yes, and both at the same time. We should be focusing on helping people deep in their spirituality through stillness. And at the same time promoting social sustainability through the Design Team Process. Do I have that right?

3. Take the design team model into other institutions

Machiventa: It’s, yes, you have that right. Do not limit yourself to just the Design Team Process. The crossover would be, I, Parent Teacher Association, for instance, a community club, communities such as Home Owners Association (HOA) in a subdivision and so on and at the city council.

So, these skills, when you bring forward, evolved a spiritual training and education and maturity. You can be an active member of great sharing great great wisdom. Add even at Civic organizations. So, the design team is a wonderful environment to for hands on training, and experience between individuals who are wrestling with a common topic. You learn how to play fair, you learn how to be courteous, you learn how to take your etiquette to a new level and encourage others to speak who haven’t for instance. Thank you.

Kona: Thank you and so what I hear you saying is to take the design team model into these other institutions to help up step them to greater social sustainability where they are. Is that correct?

Machiventa: Exactly. What you and we want you to do, is to have rational discussions in public settings. Too often there are meetings in public, a city counselor or a court or a civil hearing of some sort, and there is much shouting and so on. The evidence of a mature personality shows up in their consideration for other members, the Design Team Process is a process that has many facets that are very very helpful to the functional working and social maturity of a community, city or our nation. Thank you.

Kona: Thank you so much.

Jacques: Thank you David, I’m conscious that you’re silent that you’ve obviously been doing a lot of thinking over the last 5 min. Did you have any questions or comments David?

4. Machiventa: I am urging you to become assertive

David: Thank you. This is a personal reflection, and I would like to hear the engineer’s opinion on the matter. Last Friday, Machiventa told us that we have been too passive [up to now] and that it is time for us to “stand up and become active members”. If we were a company, we would already be selling soft drinks. We have mainly been working on our mission within an organizational structure, and we still have doubts about whether the mission and vision we are pursuing are the right ones.

I believe that we should behave like a “start-up” and be more agile and dynamic in the way we conduct ourselves. I believe we can obtain a lot of interesting information. Small companies are set up to move with ease and agility. I would like to hear some opinions on this comment about becoming less visionary and more like entrepreneurs.

Machiventa: This is Machiventa, this one chuckles because of the succinct nature of David’s response. What you are not seeing behind my recommendation of being more assertive. Is that in comparing a “startup company” to what we are doing is neglect to acknowledge and appreciate the decades of history that you as a person and as a nation, the community and in your education have learned about entrepreneurial activities of commerce, of capitalism, of trade and negotiations and so on.

“You are in a bind”, so to speak, so, you have much to learn about how to become a Planetary Manager with as much and more history of learning and experience, then any of you have for business.

So, in other words, you I am urging you to become assertive. In view of the fact of your ignorance. Ignorance here is not a pejorative word. But it is one where there’s a lack of information and of wisdom and of knowledge. So, it is not negative, but it is meant that there is a vacuum that you’re striving to fill. At the same time, you are striving to, develop your organization so, it can produce with and for you and by you. These are all very difficult processes.

You can see them, my friends, how the preparations by a good Planetary Manager over thousands of years, is essential to help critical situations as exist on your ancient now at this time. So that those individuals who would be your age and your knowledge and wisdom would have a background of education that would include all the beneficent helpful educational processes of data and history that you could read. And would have aware of to enter into a design team now.

And with that knowledge, a design team would be a piece of cake. It would be like having being coffee and puppets and cookies. As easily here you are struggling mightily and a very short period of time to produce results. Yes, my request of you is conflicting. I am asking you to be assertive. That is the quick way, that is a quick technique, eradicating your ignorance. It is important to be able to have good information and good thought patterns. As you can see, if there is any interpersonal competition or animosity or conflict in a design team. A young design team is this or Mission Urantia and other groups, you can see how that side tracks and deflects the work at hand.

5. A coherent team is the primary enabling factor that house a team focus and produce one topic at time

You are what we are striving to do, is to have you develop a coherence within your processes here. Everybody is talking about the same topic and wants to get to the end of that, so you can begin a new topic. However, there’s so much so many ancillary processes going on, that is difficult to do. The single mindedness of coherence of a coherent team is the primary enabling factor that house a team focus and produce.

I know that if I say thank you and leave you to think about this. Your heads may be spinning the best way that you can. Cool the work that you have accepted and volunteered for in this team, is to strive to take one topic at a time, this is the work of the facilitator. And this is what this one [Daniel] did with his first design team back in the fall of 2007. The question is what do you want to work on?

And then you would have, a schematic in front of you and you’d write that down. So, it’s right there in front of you all the time. And the facilitator would see whether the topic and the discussion is following that subject topic. And if there are deflections then that facilitated would bring the team back to center. One there are questions of difficulties, then the team would ask the consultant in this case myself. For assistance to clarify. This is not an easy task, this is why we have selected you. You’re mature people, you’re of age, you have great wisdom and experience working with other people. And we thought that you would become a productive members in this Team. And we are very grateful and thankful to you for volunteering. Thank you.

Jacques: Yes, David, do you have a follow up question?

David: Yes, I have a direct question, and that is, we have been working in the design team as training on topics such as “Family and public policy” and that is fine, but shouldn’t we also dedicate a session, for example, to how we store all the information and documents that we have accumulated over 30 years of work? Shouldn’t we also dedicate a session as a design team to define the specific goals that you want us to have as individuals? Shouldn’t we also have a session as a design team to work on the communication strategies we are going to use?

6. To work as a Team you need to be succinct and clear while asking questions that are on the topic discussed

Daniel: David, this is Daniel. You’re very bright fellow. You have a very fast mind and you have; it’s true; an important repertoire of memories and information. And your statements are so lengthy and diverse and it is difficult for us to get a grasp of what you may be saying. This is a compliment.

However, for a working team when a speaker has such volumes of information. It behooves them. To then provide a summation statement at the end. What do you want? What do you need? What do you have to have? Hey, in order for your answer to be your question to be answered. And then there’s always the ability to ask delineating questions from there, which is a wise thing to do; secondary, tertiary quaternary questions.

These are exercises in assertiveness, and I know that for about thirty minutes we have been practicing just that. Now, regarding the design team: you are a team representing six personalities that I see in front of me—seven, including myself.

You have the right to decide. You can say, “Oh my Gosh Daniel,” or “Oh my goodness, Machiventa, this is too broad. We can’t handle this right now.” And that is assertiveness. You are simply stating, “This is too much for us at this moment. We don’t want to answer that question right now.”

You would also express this assertively by requesting clarity—by saying what you truly want, in short and direct terms.

This is part of the facilitator’s role: to be assertive in helping the team recognize its capacity and to support it in addressing the question or issue at hand, okay, thank you.

David: Gracias.

Daniel: David if I might say, just briefly. I appreciate where you’re trying to go. But I think, I’ve been studying this, material now for a long, long time. And it’s been emphasized that in the initial stages of a team’s development, which could be 5, 6, 7, 8 meetings. We’re working out, our idiosyncrasies and our personality traits and we get an over practical hurdles about to run a team. And I feel that we’re doing quite well here.

We can always go back and study other matters, perhaps we were shooting too high here, perhaps we’d bitten off a little bit more than we can chew. Well, the way to find that out is to actually work with the schematic. And understand where we’re lacking in understanding as it were, we can learn from that process. And also this team is an educational tool, for the formation of future teams.

I don’t think we should ever forget that. So, our performance is educational whether it’s successful or whether it’s not successful. And, I’ve been studying this 12 years ago, during Monjoronson’s Conversations number 50 with Sondjah and it was just Daniel Sondjah and Michael McCray, an old friend who’s passed on. And, it’s a very informative document because is pointing out that, we’re setting a very high, high standard here for, for effective performance. We’re not exactly experts. Any of us were generalists, but we certainly have good educations. And we know they know, you know, the celestials know that this is going to be a slow process.

We have to accept that if we start bringing patients in too early—before we are fully prepared—we risk setting a poor example. If we try to run before we can walk, we undermine the process. This is a long-term effort, and it requires patience to engage it properly.

Kona: I have another question for Machiventa regarding a proposed design for a working group collaborating with the Planetary Management Team, and I would appreciate his feedback on it. Since I’m a business brain and thinking about new structures for nonprofits and businesses going forward. I just had a simple question. It’s something I worked on yesterday if that’s permissible at this time. If not, I’ll save it.

Machiventa: So, with that preload, why don’t you just ask the question?

7. Exploring the possibility of the [Celestial] Planetary Management Team working Co-Creatively with the [Human] Design Team

Kona: Perfect, thank you so much Machiventa, yesterday in stillness, I have been working through a model that explores the possibility of the [Celestial] Planetary Management Team working Co-Creatively with the [Human] Design Team.To give direction let’s say even to perhaps Mission Urantia or any other spiritually minded organization that does work Co-Creatively with you. But as they work together to then provide direction to the board of directors.

It’s the bringing in the spirituality over and above what is on the planet right now, which is where a board of directors makes all of the decisions in an old paradigm. And I’m wondering about a new paradigm where the 2 [Human & Celestials] work co-creatively to give direction to the board of directors and then give direction for the organization. And I’m wondering if that is something that is plausible or useful? Thank you.

Machiventa: I honor your question and it is an important question that we advise you to ask you again in 20 years. You’re way ahead of your time. Yeah, if this is a deflection. And, if I gave you accurate answers now, you would not be able to implement those answers. Even in the next 5 years. I’m not saying that your inquiry is a waste of time. It shows signs of an advanced mind thinking about futuristic situations. As a futurist you know that you live in the here and now, that you do have to go to the grocery store and that you do have to put gasoline in your car and so on. And we are, I advise people to, I have those thoughts in mind and discuss them among yourselves, but is not a question I wish to engage at this time. Thank you.

Kona: Thank you so much Machiventa

8. Question on How to archive the 30 years of TM Transcripts

Jacques: Yes, Marthe please ask your question

Marthe: I just wondered Machiventa if we can just go back to the 2 questions that David had asked. He was just wondering if we should be looking at Design Teams on how to archive all the Transcripts of the last 30 years? And another one on defining exactly what our precise goals are? And if that would be useful at this time? Thank you.

Machiventa: This is Machiventa, as for the archiving and in consideration of Kona’s question. These questions are a topic for a Design Team. And looking five years ahead, I envision having worked directly with at least 30 different Design Teams. This topic would be assigned to a design team to figure out. And it would do so by investigating with other members of other teams concerning the issues that they are working about. It is one thing to do the technology to house all of these things which could be done now with the 2 or 3 dedicated individuals.

But it’s also far more than just, technological, innovations to assist to the process of archiving many from many sources. It involves the topics and the relationship with the topics of AI software to relate those topics. You were fortunate that AI programs are being developed that do this very thing.

But AI is “not human”. And it do not have a rule of ethics guiding their decisions. This will come in time. Even you see the simple task of our archiving. Is beyond the capability or capacity of this team. When you get into goals. This would be one of the goals that you would determine. And as you work on a team to develop the goals, you would have in mind that the goals would be attached to its own separate design team.

9. As a Design Team we recommend to work one topic at a time this is highly advisable

As you know the topics that you’re dealing with are mountain in the dozens and hundreds. And that you are striving to answer them as easily and as concisely as possible. The task of this team and perhaps the other teams is to really become more concise on the question that they want to ask and answer. May be the answers aren’t important, but the process of arriving at those answers are. And as was suggested, the schematic is a process to help you do that and to keep track of that.

One topic at a time is highly advisable. This is like teaching children to learn how to build a house. You begin by taking little round wooden pegs, and giving a small wooden hammer to the child and asking them to pound the pegs through these holes. And the holes are round, pair, middle, and so on. And that they learn these skills slowly. And that’s where you, you, wonderful people are at this time. Thank you.

10. How to teach Design Team Methodology to other Teams: prepare a Training Manual based on your own Team experience

Marthe: Thank you so much for that answer, Machiventa. While you were speaking, it just suddenly struck me. Would it be useful for us to try and find a way into teaching design team methodology? Obviously once we understand it, directly to AI. Surely AI would do very well with the design team methodology. Wouldn’t that be trying to get into the AI industry? With some of these methods, would that be useful? Thank you.

Machiventa: This is a futurist idea that has great practicality. You are in fact learning to now examine the processes going on in this, this workbook, this training guide. That would be a great assistance to other teams and of course eventually to AI. When AI is ready for it, you are.

Let me make one contribution to this folder. This 3 rings binder that you’re going to make as a training manual and number one is: as this one took notes last week. That is to:

– one have a pre team training session for preparing individuals who volunteer to the team to work together. This was missing and this has been a major factor in all of the design teams that are now in process.

– You need to have few pages in this 3 rings binder, that illustrate the roles of individuals.

Many of the fastest of a design team in preparation that would occur during the early stages. For one, this team has never had a team bonding a social session. You have bonded by the mere fact of working through. These tedious problems and difficulties that you have been engaging.

– Team bonding is essential to build trust in the other individuals and to know the limits of their capabilities. It helps when team members also know the limitations their own personal limitations for group work. This, this is an intimate topic and therefore it takes trust to discuss this. So, there are many facets of this team and other teams that are now in process that have not been have not occurred.

So, as you begin working on this 3 rings binder, which would make a wonderful topic. Forget about policy to forget about many other things. And now that you are acquainted with the limitations of your team, you can now begin understanding what the team needs, other teams need. And so you would begin building a training, a manual. It does not have to be perfect. Hey, it would include all sorts of notes that you have to yourself. Some wisdom that you have garnered through the days and weeks. And that these would be sorted out eventually. Thank you.

Daniel: Thank you, Machiventa thank you, any further questions for Machiventa? Okay no more question, then we’re ready to come back to the HEALTHCARE subject or are we gonna stick with these basic procedural matters so we get that clear as a team. Yes, Kona.

11. Group discussion on healthcare system and health using the schematics

Kona: I was just thinking that maybe you wanted to wrap up the schematic because you had said earlier that David and I were not present so that might be a place to start just to finish that before taking on something.

Daniel: Yes, indeed. I’d be happy to do so. So, let’s just get down to work and then if we need to, bring the consultant back in, we will. So, could somebody share the Healthcare Schematic on the Zoom screen?

Jacques: I’m trying to get it on just give me 1 s.

Daniel: On the subject of healthcare, it seems clear that we have different mindsets about what that term actually means. Work on the healthcare system has often focused on examining the system itself and building extensive knowledge about how it functions. I have always tended to see it differently—bringing the focus back to the individual. In fact, there is an ambiguity in the title itself. I believe we should be discussing health and healthcare as two related but distinct concepts.

So that we’ve broadened the subject a bit. If we just talk about healthcare, tends to imply we’re just talking about disease management. But I’ll throw that up for discussion, but you see what I mean. Every time I speak, I bring in something to do with the individual. And every time Bea speaks, she would bring in something about the institution and they’re not meshing very well in my mind. So that’s one aspect of the schematic I think we ought to review. Yes, Kona.

Kona: We could have 2 different subjects, perhaps they belong on 2 different schematics, one on health care and one for health.

Daniel: That could well be true except that they’re absolutely no point in talking about health care system until you know how healthy your population is? I mean, in the future, we would hope that there would be far less need for an institutionalized healthcare system.

So, this is what I’m referring to is as a “broad subject” but, If we examine just the healthcare system as it relates to the present day, I think we’re missing the point entirely, that’s all I mean. So, I’m not sure we’re happy with this, and I’m not sure we actually decided we’re moving things from 1 one situation to another is this an expectation or is this a belief and so let’s examine this.

Marthe: Yes, certainly, we can start right at the beginning. We had just started trying to incorporate the 7 areas of human development. And the issue of equality and quality of life. So, I thought we had the first one we did quite well. I thought all those questions were answered. It was also becoming very clear as we spoke about the health care system that almost all the responsibility lies with the individual.

Daniel: Well, this is exactly what I was talking about, but most of that was introduced by myself. So that’s my bias. That’s my inherent bias towards the subject, you see what I’m saying? And most of the, the input from Bea for instance, would be more down to studies, you know, actual medical studies that would determine these things and so on and so forth. So, I think we’re kind of floating around between these 2 areas. And we need to tighten that up a little bit.

Marthe: Yeah, because we haven’t filled in all the things for bea, one about epidemiological studies. Remember David, also spoke about the need to use data to ascertain how many people need care. So, we haven’t really. Worked more on that.

Daniel: Exactly so, I think it’s time for David and Kona really to get their input in on this. We might want to, might want to rewrite some of these or, you know, this, phone consensus.

Kona: Certainly. Sure, can I see the top of those schematics again, please go ahead.

Jacques: Thank you.

Daniel: This is Daniel I’m gonna withdraw, and I’ll see you back here next week. Okay, God bless you.

Group: Bye, bye thank you Daniel, thanks so much, thank you Sherille

Daniel: Bye

End of Part 1

Part 2 – Group dialogue & discussion

Main Themes and Summaries Part 2

Design Team Discussion – March 15 (Friday, Part 2)

1. Health Care vs. Health Creation

The discussion differentiates between institutional health care systems and the broader concept of health creation. Participants emphasize prevention, education, and social conditions as fundamental determinants of health, rather than focusing solely on medical treatment. Health is framed as a collective, systemic responsibility.

2. Personal Responsibility and Its Limits

While personal responsibility for health is acknowledged, the group recognizes clear limits due to genetics, disability, aging, trauma, and socio-economic constraints. Many individuals cannot manage their health independently without structured community and institutional support.

3. Equity, Equality, and Access to Health

Equality is defined as equitable access rather than identical treatment. The team agrees that achieving equality requires upscaling the capacity of disadvantaged individuals and families through education, resources, and community-based support systems.

4. Preconception and Early-Life Health Policy

Participants stress the ethical and pragmatic importance of giving every child the best possible start in life. Preconception care and early health screening are discussed as means to reduce preventable suffering and long-term societal burden, while acknowledging implementation challenges.

5. Family Learning Centers as Foundational Infrastructure

Family Learning Centers are identified as a cornerstone solution for long-term social sustainability. These centers would integrate health education, prevention, family support, and community engagement across the full human lifespan.

6. Assumptions, Biases, and Design Ethics

The team actively examines its own assumptions, privileges, and unconscious biases. A key insight is that policies must be designed for real end-users, including those with limited education, crisis conditions, or reduced capacity for self-care.

7. Design Team Methodology and Validation Through Values

The Design Team process is reinforced as a disciplined methodology. All proposals must be validated against the seven core values; any missing value signals that a policy is not socially sustainable and requires revision.

8. Spiritual Values as Universal Human Values

Spiritual principles are reframed as universal human values inherent to all people, regardless of belief system. This framing allows the work to remain inclusive and applicable to secular institutions, governments, and diverse cultures.

9. Language, Inclusion, and Collaborative Tools

Language barriers and technical complexity are recognized as internal equity issues. Visual and collaborative tools such as Miro are proposed to support inclusive participation, especially for non-native English speakers.

10. Team Process, Bonding, and Emotional Safety

Beyond outcomes, the document highlights the importance of trust, empathy, patience, and emotional safety within the team. Transparent dialogue and mutual respect are seen as essential to effective collaboration.

11. Free Will vs. Policy Implementation

The group discusses the balance between respecting free will and implementing social policies. Family Learning Centers and health initiatives are envisioned as voluntary services that attract participation through demonstrated value rather than coercion.

12. Long-Term Vision and Planetary Perspective

The work is framed within a long-term planetary transformation process. Participants accept that results may take generations to manifest and emphasize resilience, service, and responsibility to future generations.

Part 2 Group Discusssion

Jacques
Basic office. Okay. Okay. Good. Okay. So, you see what I mean? So it’s a health care. I mean, perhaps we should all. Make a statement really about what we think we are looking into. We’re looking into an institutional. The institution that provides health care. Or are we looking at the need for health care? Are we looking at? What prompts? You know, diseases within our societies and how we do with that. Yes.

Kona
Thank you. I just want to go back to the beliefs and the assumptions. You just said that one of your assumptions is that people are responsible for their own health. We also know that people have a wide variety of, you know, people get born with spina bifida and with just an enormous amount of genetic diseases. So obviously their health care needs that have nothing to do with self-care. Or with personal responsibility they have to do with genetics and with so is, is one of our biases that we think people can do a lot about their health when maybe not all people can. I mean clearly people can’t and as you get older less so.

Jacques
Yeah, no, I think that’s reasonable. I also, you know, one of our policies should be that before an individual is even born into the world. That they have the best possible chance of leading a healthy productive life, which would mean again, this is coming back to pragmatics that would have to be certain genetic. Yeah. Testing procedures. That would determine whether that child was going to have these issues and these problems and which would be a burden on society. That it’s important to have that in place now how that’s actually implemented. Of course is another thing for another team, but we would have to have that. You want people born. As healthy as they can possibly be. Not to have that in place is really a lottery. You just, you know, which is not acceptable. Going forward, I feel. Yes, Kona.

Kona
Well, David did have his hand up before me, but, so I’m happy to. To wait for his comment.

Jacques
Okay, David. Just not. That. Yeah, you’re muted at the moment, David.

David
Esta es una pregunta para ti marta porque quiero que me ayudes con la traducción ya que me siento un poco extraviado en qué es lo que tenemos que hacer en este momento de manera específica yo veo que ya se adelantaron las 2 primeras columnas el número de personas que viven una vida larga y después menos necesidad de tratamiento por parte del sistema sanitario estas 2 filas ya están prácticamente terminadas pero no entiendo por qué tienen una x en lugar de un sí y esa es una pregunta y la segunda.

Marthe
Ok. They need to have yes, you’re right. Yes, sorry, sorry. They need to have yes, am I right, Jeff? And he just wanted to understand what we need to do now. And I guess we just try to show them. And see if they agree.

Jacques
Yeah, I I think it’s a really good question. I mean, Yeah, I mean, ultimately we have to check everything that we have in the schematic has to be validated against column 10. Yeah. As I understand it. And And that includes all of those 7 values within column 10. If any one of them is missing then that’s a red flag that that policy or that expectation or that belief is not socially sustainable. So. That’s how I understand it. Now. I don’t really understand what the column of interpreted values is referring to because that’s a subjective opinion, is it not? Hmm. Hmm.

Kona
It would be each of our individual subjective opinion on how to interpret those values. So, you know, that’s where I think we need to look a little closer. Let me get Cona in here and see what she has to say.

Jacques
Yeah, so, I think that you’re spot on with that, Jeff, about the interpreted values. I think the difference between 9 and 10. Is the values that you’re bringing to the table. In comparison to let’s say ideal values that we have in. That’s one. The second thing that I wanted to, I’m remembering now that I was reflecting on is in the design team training. So, I permission you, Rancho, I posted, a blurb about this. That may be helpful for this group. Design teams are not unique. To you be readers. Design teams exist in the world and on the planet for the development of all kinds of products, buildings. And everything else. So. We are. Bringing a different perspective to design team training in that we have a spiritual foundation and spiritual values that we are aligning ourselves with to create truly sustainable, socially sustainable organizations. Even the concept of social sustainability is not unique to you be readers. It’s it’s a catch phrase across the globe. So that’s one thing. So in design team training that I’m doing. At the graduate level. The one thing that. Weird we’re discussing now. The perspective that so much designing is done. Without the end user in mind. So the phrase, the designer is not the user. Is something that designers need to remember. And creating a persona. For the user and understanding the user. While you’re in the process of designing. And so what I’m seeing here is we. All one have a UV background. Relatively well educated. Probably somewhat privileged in our community in comparison to people. In other parts of the world and what I’m most mindful right now is that we are making decisions and and they and decisions that need to be made. But with certain assumptions that we’re not considering, we’re making assumptions about the receivers of these policies and one of the assumptions is they have the capacity. Or the understanding to do things for themselves. When so much of the world’s population is uneducated. Hmm. Does not have access to. The education and health care. And are not in a position. You to make. Quality decisions for themselves. That’s one.

Jacques
Okay, can I stop you the kind of awful lot of stuff that you’ve come out with there?

Kona
Sure.

Jacques
And, I would say yes, yes, it’s true. A lot of the assumptions that you’ve made there are true. But what we’re trying to do here is we’re all human. You said that, you know, we’ve. We’re developing, we all have a spiritual background, but what we, what we have come to learn through that spiritual background, but what we what we have come to learn through that spiritual background and through that spiritual evolution. Is that these values that we’re talking about a human values. These are these are the values that make us human. Never mind, don’t get into, you know, and being human involves 7 areas. If you One of which, a very important one of which is spiritual. However, we have to be cognizant of all of these. At all times. So these are human values. Let’s not. Get away from that. It’s been pointed out from celestial sources. Yes. But they pointing it out. They point in these values out these things that already exist within us.

Kona
Yeah, I have no argument.

Jacques
That are actually built into our DNA. And therefore, you know, it’s just a matter of recognizing that that’s been the problem. So what we’re trying to do in my view in it’s better to do this and I can draw on Sanj’s statements in the past to back this up. Is that we want to appeal not only to spiritual people or people that call themselves spiritual. Because there’s not a human being on the planet. That has a thought adjusted that isn’t spiritual. Whether they understand that or not is another thing that we want to appeal to everybody secular businesses. Governments and everything else. So in our own particular team is what I’m talking about. This should be our focus to reach the widest possible audience.

Kona
Yes, Corona, you want to follow up there?

Jacques
Yeah, I think that you misunderstood me and I didn’t finish, but you might have been able to understand me if I had been able to commit. It really. I couldn’t remember what you said at the start cone, it was so long. That’s what I was trying to point out to you. My. You have to have short statements that we can all take in and process. And then we could, if you could go back to your original statements and go through slower. I’d appreciate that.

Kona
Okay, I think the most important piece. Is that We keep in mind, especially with our beliefs and assumptions. That we there are people on the planet. Now and post-apocalyptic that we’re designing for. That are going to be in a state of crises. For and lack the education in order to take care of themselves. The assumption is is that all individuals have a number 2 all individuals have an equal right to healthy life and quality. And then also that they should. Where was it that they should be able to do this themselves? Maintaining their own health number 3. That participate. There was always. It was always supported by the family in the community. It was and they were never asked to do it themselves until they had the ability to do it themselves. And they will only get that ability if they’d been taught. By their family and community. In order to have those abilities. Yep. Okay, so those are the expectations that they’ll be taught and the bleep is as once they’re, then they’ll be able to maintain. Okay. That’s exactly right. And they have the support systems in order to be able to do that. So they would be a family learning center. There would be a family health clinic. They would be community involvement with their health. In the future. Okay, so I think maybe then my thinking is the gap. Until we have the family learning centers in place. They can do these things. I guess this policy is not going to be it’s a goal policy, but it’s going to be a challenge to implement. Okay. Oh, absolutely. It’s gonna take many, many years, but the same is, we’re starting the process right at the start here. How do we design such a family learning center? For each of our communities if we looked at our communities now at their needs. We understand, we coming from, you spiritually educated, as you have said. We have all of these advantages. Who else is going to sit down and see what needs to be? What is the curricula for these family learning centers? Okay. How many people will you need? How much space would you need? You know to cover the entire continuum of a person’s life from preconception right through until death So this is what we’re in the process of doing of trying to come up with these sort of insights and eventually, hopefully, policies and plans and designs. That we could start to actually implement these, but we would have to get another team with expertise. To then look at that situation you present to them and say, okay, well, we’ll have to look into this now, the actual construction of these things, the actual staffing. Would be other teams. But we have to have the initial umbrella, if you will, of understanding and a vision. So these things, these details can be worked out. So that’s what I see. Us is doing as this design team specifically because it’s part of the magisterial mission.

Marthe
Yes, Martha. Thank you. Thank you. No, David’s hand was up. I just want to know must I write what Kona has just said which is really important. Into in order to get equality we will have to upscale the skills of self-care of some members of the community.

Jacques
Absolutely, absolutely. Get that.

Marthe
Am I right? So can I put it in this one? Because then we won’t have equality. I’m just gonna say here, and then David can ask his. Equality. Okay.

Jacques
Yes, David.

David
Es pregunta para ti marta después de este largo diálogo que tuvieron jeff y cona yo sigo un poco confundido cuál qué qué es lo que ellos están hablando See, See, Ka, Estabel, and, and, and, and, and, I’ll print CPU. Cuál es el el el eje de lo que ellos están diciendo claro.

Marthe
Look at Ajavia question or true lad, OK. A. DD. Hocino sutrasomo’s moi preblijiados, the Nemo’ Perla Maeuri Lacente Aora, catastrophe, civilisus, you know, is to go to the MEHORRASsu Propia salute. Endorses, 80 DAMOS, Attention, Ii, I/O, Joy, It’s Civian Doaaora, but the Nemo-skeepensar anesto. So maybe Kona, if you can help me write that sentence.

David
Ok está bien gracias.

Kona
What you said, maybe we’ll have to listen to the recording. Equality will need to be ensured. Or each individual or for the individuals or the families. I’m not. I’m trying to remember exactly what you said. It was just about the that people with less. With less education and less capacity to improve their own health. Yeah. Quality will need to be insured for individual and family education and access to resources perhaps. So I, the challenge that I, that I’m finding as well. This whole concept of free will. Versus this has to be the policy and it has to be done, right? We have this balance of these are our policies and these things must take place. And then we have. Individuals have free will. So do they actually get to choose to follow the policy? Have you guys thought about?

Jacques
Well, what exactly, I think that’s a very good point, but that will always remain. So it’s been said right from the start that you might create these these family learning centers which I feel is where we’re heading. Ultimately. You might create these family learning centers, but you can’t, you know, You can’t force people to go there. That’s not what’s being suggested. What’s being suggested is that we present These things as a service to the community and those that are and obviously we try and reach out to the community to draw people in. It’s a start. If it works, as it will, then people will automatically say, hello, why haven’t we been doing this before? We obviously need this. Our community and so on. So we’re just we’re setting the parameters for a better way of doing this but obviously we’re starting we starting at the lowest run of the ladder and it’s going to take quite a while before we get to a function in. You know family learning center. But it starts here. I mean, I’m already thinking in terms of my own area. Clearly what I come up with isn’t going to really j with what Martha might be visualizing for, the women to organize in South Africa and so on. And David would be looking at how he can implement. A family learning center in his own locality. So these will differ in terms of cultural things and there will be certain but the basic values will be the same. I think this is the point. The basic values will be cemented into those designs. So there’ll be no getting away from it. That’s where I think we’re at with this. So You know, I think it’d be good to get, Jack back because to complete this process. With the, with a schematic, but. It’s been an interesting exercise for me because just we’re examining our own assumptions and our own beliefs as we go through this and I think that’s the whole point. And we’re being transparent with the rest of the team as to what we think and what we believe and we can do so in a safe environment. We’re not antagonistic. We’re all trying to work towards the same end. So I think it I’m happy with the way the process is going. I wish we had a better way. I wish I spoke Spanish, actually. That would make life a lot easier for me. Not David. That’s David, something to say.

David
Hace algún tiempo me puse a hacer doméstica en mi casa Me puse a limpiar un baño y tardé tardé en limpiar mi baño alrededor de 3 h. Hmm. No porque estuviera muy sucio sino porque usé la técnica incorrecta. Yeah. De que me yo les doy mi palabra de honor de que yo pude haber hecho en 15 min lo que hice en 3 h. Pongo a maki venta y a mikael como. And. Please. Estamos estamos eso mismo pasa en este momento lo que estamos haciendo estamos haciendo estamos utilizando un cuadro esquemático Difícil de seguir y de entender. Hmm. Hmm. Número 1 no estamos utilizando sí por favor.

Marthe
Okay, can I just translate? Can I just translate up to the?

Jacques
Yeah, yeah, just catch us up a bit.

Marthe
I think it’s he started very beautifully. He said it took him 3 h to clean his bathroom. Which it would have taken him 15 min if he had used the right technique. At the moment we are using a wrong technique to fill in the schematic because he’s already told us about Mero. And this is, we’re using a schematic that is difficult to fill in and difficult to understand. Contin. You still speaking? I think you.

David
Ok yo soy paciente y los observo. Okay. Me observo a mí mismo entrando en debates cuando todo se puede resolver fácilmente. Es difícil para los que no conocen estas técnicas entender la facilidad que representan para ayudarnos en nuestros procesos de trabajo colaborativo Yo sé que para algunos de ustedes puede ser algo muy complejo pero en realidad es muy fácil. Wait. El design a adelante marta.

Marthe
I just wanted to say, so he’s just saying it, might seem difficult for us to understand what he’s trying to teach us, how much quick it would be if we were using Meet row or those who yellow post post it’s yeah the design thinking.

Jacques
Yeah, could I just say though, I think we’ve already understood this. We’re going over the same ground here, David. The thing is, as I understood it, You and other people with technical ability. Jacques. In particular, we’re gonna look at this and try and get us all onto the Mural platform, which would be a lot easier. To go through these things. We’re using this schematic because it’s It’s what Daniel has produced in his life. He wants to see us. Use it. He wants to see us work through it. It is difficult, but it’s meant to be difficult. I would say if we make the process too easy, We’ll actually be missing a lot of the nuances that they’re trying to bring out in this. Design team process. Yes, Kona.

Kona
Yes, I actually met with Daniel about this last week and we discussed the the challenges of the schematic and in fact, you know, part of what Mac Aventa was addressing this morning. And with Daniel. Is a part that this team did not go through the bonding process and it becomes more difficult when there’s things that you haven’t done. So for instance, I pointed out for Daniel. He developed the schematic. In, in his therapy process, he had an issue. That he had to go through and that it came out of that. My my my thought on that was Yes. Each of us. Takes a personal issue. To examine against the life that the innate values. And we personally work back. This is the discussion that I had with him as part of this. What he even described this morning. Of preteen training. If you take that issue and you look at yourself on one thing and you go, well, what what is the criteria that I want? What are my expectations? What are my beliefs? What are my values that that were created? And then look at that against these. If we had had that training piece. This wouldn’t be as difficult because then we would be familiar with how we are personally thinking. And how our values are affecting this process.

Jacques
That’s exactly right, Conan. So the thing is, we are actually doing that now, except that we’re doing it and tripping over and you know, realizing and so on. So this is the way that it’s developed. This thing has been in existence for well over 15 years. I’ve been looking at it for well over 12 years. I’ve got here. At least 10 transcripts that relate directly to this process. Over the years and I I always print mine out so I have a me and hard copy in front of me. The thing is, it’s never been a great thing for me. I don’t feel drawn to this schematic, but it is challenging to this schematic, but it is challenging me. To examine the way that I think. Is challenging me to take on other people’s viewpoints and consider them. And I think ultimately if we stick to it and we have enough resilience and patients, we will start to see results. Again, I’m speaking as I’m standing in for Jack. Today as facilitator he’ll be back online next week i hope and he is very adamant about going through this process, working through it, not getting this not getting distraught by it. It’s simply working through it. We’re a team. We’re learning. We’re helping other people to learn about how to go about these things. One. With your expertise, in the team. This has been amazing because, But at the same time you said that we roll, you know, we’re all members, we’re all believing the correct in time, we’re all you be readers and so on and so forth. That may be, but I can assure you. That we all love completely different perspectives and what that means in our lives. And that we’ve all been interacting with various different parts of the teaching mission in the majesty of a mission. So there are still disconnects even between us. So this is the important thing to remember. If you’re taking somebody coming straight off the street. We don’t want to confuse them with a lot of information that isn’t going to help them practically. To sort out their own lives in their own communities. This is what I feel our our really, our responsibility is to Help everyone. Irrespective of their, of their particular place along the line of spiritual development. Matthew, your question. The ones, once and is up.

Jacques
Oh, Wong, love to, you’d love to hear from you, sir. Please one.

Juan
Gracias buenos días para todos bueno hablando lo que plantea david acerca de yo me permití hacer un tablero miro acerca del de lo que estamos tratando voy a compartir la pantalla.

Marthe
Okay, have you finished one? Martha.

Juan
Están viendo.

Marthe
Okay. No ya.

Jacques
He’s showing his screen. Jeff, he’s going to he did a he did a sample on Miro he’d like to show us.

Marthe
Great, great.

Juan
Como ustedes verán hice una un tablerito de full friedman tri talla verdad donde están diferentes diferentes. Okay. Tenemos la sostenibilidad del ambiente o ambiental tenemos la participación pública tenemos la los principios de hollywood en su ok y todos irían a lo que la esta parte aquí tenemos también los derechos humanos y tenemos integración y te principio de de ok en esta parte expuse las expectativas que esperábamos que esperamos a eso entonces esperamos el acto universal a la salud la. Por qué. promoción y prevención de de de enfermedades igualdad en el acceso a los recursos de salud bien esta emoción la armonía con el ambiente. Pero esto es un ejemplo más o menos de cómo podemos trabajar con miro entonces habiendo un tablero principal que es el grupo yo trabajaría cualquier cosa a la parte de discusión. Y si y es apropiado se podría agregar a a los resultados. Aquí tenemos los valores interpretados. Los el derecho universal a la salud creemos en que todas las personas pueden tienen derecho al acceso a la salud como por ejemplo entonces eso son cosas con inteligencia artificial también o sea no todo es de mi cabeza sino también es ayudado por la inteligencia potencial y espero que sirva ok muchísimas gracias.

Marthe
Yes, thank you. You’re muted. You’re muted, Martha. Yeah, absolutely.

Jacques
Well done, one. Thank you so much for that. I just have a quick question.

Juan
A ver.

Marthe
And, and thanks for using artificial intelligence as well. Yeah, I just want to know. How do you? Is there a way that Miro will help you? Put everybody’s It won’t summarize anything for you. If I put mine David put his Jeff puts his Kona put hers. Miro is not going to summarize at all for you in a single sentence. One. And secondly, how will you measure them against the 10 or the 7 values. Do you have to do that yourself as well? Miro will not automatically do that for you. Bye.

Jacques
Maybe you tell him in Spanish.

Marthe
Yes, when you Ask him in Spanish. Go on, Yes. One of the Tina Miro. Okay.

Jacques
Oh, we’re losing you, Martha. Losing you, Martha, we breaking up.

Marthe
He’s a But, Rasumar. Whatsapp.

Jacques
Okay.

Juan
Esta pregunta yo se la transferiría a mi amigo david que creo que tiene algo.

Jacques
Oh.

Marthe
A ver. David.

David
Y vigencia artificial sin embargo. No estoy seguro de que nosotros queremos que miro haga esa interpretación yo creo que es una interpretación que nosotros debemos hacer. Creo que lo que estamos haciendo juan y yo como latinos es mostrarles la necesidad que tenemos de poder expresarnos en un idioma en donde no estamos familiarizados al 100 y estas tecnologías nos permiten a nosotros que abramos un idioma diferente ser muy precisos en nuestras propuestas por eso hay tanta insistencia de mi parte en que podamos nosotros estar preparados con una estructura.

Marthe
They equal that. See. Okay. Hmm.

David
metodológica que nos permita expresarnos para sumarnos a ustedes y no solamente estarlos escuchando el trabajo y igualdad el trabajo que hizo daniel es muy valioso y seguirá siendo muy valioso durante mucho tiempo. Hmm. Sin embargo por algo estamos aquí y este trabajo maravilloso de daniel puede ser enriquecido con las técnicas del diseine team del pensamiento del diseñador es todo nos hemos apartado mucho del tema original gracias por ser no solo quería darles mensaje. Hmm. Hmm.

Jacques
Es traducido.

Kona
No, Could you could you enlighten me?

Marthe
Yes, no thank you. It was just for me also a lightbulb moment. He’s saying he doesn’t know whether Miro can do those summaries. The reason why he suggested that the design Thinking method of Miro is that he and Quan supremely disadvantaged by the way we working at the moment. Whereas in Miro they can beautifully set out their ideas. In a way that all of us can understand and they not hamstrung by by the lack of of English Yeah.

Jacques
Okay, if I might as a facilitator, I’m a little bit confused because I thought that We’d already accepted as a team. Hmm. That it would be a lot smarter. Particularly with those people who have the ability to use every tool at our disposal. That includes Miro. In order to come to some and well thought out. Concludions. Once we’ve done that by whatever means, we can always take 5 min to fill out the Daniel’s schematic. Yep. Hmm. We, you know, the thing is, it’s not about this or that. So I’ve already bought into the idea, the fact that I have no technical skill. And I will need a certain amount of training. Doesn’t put me off, it’s simply a fact. So I’m I thought we’d already agreed and Jack was already on board that we would in fact bring this tool on board. And use it. So I don’t think there’s any disputes here with that. The thing is, it’s not operable now. Some of our members are not here and so on and so forth. So we go into a process here. I don’t think it’s gonna benefit us to get inpatient. Bearing in mind this is a centuries long process. That we won’t live to see. I think it’s best if we can Do all of these things, but let’s let’s go through it slowly. That’s not panic. When we’re all up and running on Miro We can test it’s affecting us ourselves. You won’t have to convince us. Yes, Martha.

Marthe
Thank you very much. I think 2 of the big things that came out for me this time. Was Kona’s reminder. That there is incredible inequality in access to health of people. And even access to their own self improving health. And David and Juan’s reminder. The incredible inequality of us speaking English using Daniels very difficult schematic. There being easier ways to allow other people to show their language proficiency. So I really loved that. May I suggest we’re not going to have we have half an hour lift. May I suggest that we actually use this time where only 5 people to listen to to talk about the Buyuses? In our own lives that would affect our assumptions so we get to know a bit of this. What do you call this? Okay. A bunch team bonding. Where we learn about each other’s biases so that next time we have some more information. It’s a great idea. I think most of these biases are largely unconscious, Marta.

Marthe
Yeah.

Jacques
And, they simply come out, they simply come out in general conversation. What’s important is that we’re not trying to hide those assumptions and that we’re not Stuck in our ways to the extent that we’re not contributing to the team. I mean, if you ask people to come up with what they thought they biases were. I think you’d find that they’d probably be inaccurate. Because it’s a subjective viewpoint really. Other people might think that your biased and you don’t. So I think this is the process of the team process actually in action. Where these things will come out over time. And if we have a commitment to stick to the process. These things are work through. In the end we realize Okay, Jeff gets a little bit over excited. Sometimes he need he falls off of his chair, but ultimately he comes back to the reasonable position we can have a discussion. We’re not We’re a cooperative team. And, we do all have, strengths and weaknesses. But we’re not trying to exploit those, we’re just trying to become aware of those as it affects our arguments and as it affects our strategies and our plans. So. You can try that out, but I wonder, I don’t like to even examine what my positive, things are and assume that I already know what they are. Quite apart from my biases. But. I was born at a certain age. I am at a certain age. So one of my biases is in patients. I’ve been working on this stuff for 25 years. I want to see some results. But that’s a bit egotistical. When you understand long view or the long arc of human development, as Mac Avender might put it, you realize that such an attitude is immature. It’s simply, you know, my in patience has got nothing to do with anything. So. I have to overcome that in patience and I have to you know to understand that this is a slow process but it’s a process that once completed successfully won’t need to be repeated. Other teams will come in. They’ll look at this process of being going through and they’ll This will help them to overcome their own prejudices. This is what I think this process is about. I’ve got a quote here. If I might. If you’d indulge me. Hmm. Which is. From Sanjay. 12 years ago. Quote, this design team process sets a high standards for effective performance. But on the other hand, we know that many teams will not be effective immediately. And some will not ever be effective in the long term. But for the main, these instructions must be useful. To form teams for most average individuals. Who are inclined to be helpful to humankind and the course of this world. So this doesn’t exclude people that don’t call themselves spiritual. This doesn’t exclude people. That have other views to our own. We’re all living on the same planet and ultimately these 7 values are what makes us human. And you you be hard pushed. To refute these values. If you’re asked to do so. Yeah. Yes, Conan.

Kona
Yeah, I hear, Jeff, you expressing, your perspective and I value that. I think one of from my perspective. And and what I’ve heard from Macaventa, Daniel, and in the design team process. Is And I think I’ve stated this before. Part of the purpose of this, one is to learn the process. But, but also to live into the relationship building required for us. To demonstrate our own personal understanding. Of the 7 core values. Yeah, we’ve spent a lot of time on life. But if we go to love. Expressed through compassion and empathy. Then it would be important. To demonstrate that here. And have compassion and empathy on our team members who are struggling with the language. And to create an equitable place. For them to purchase. And I think that was the point. For Quan and David. Is that we.

Jacques
Yes, thanks. Yeah, it was it was a point well taken and the thing is it’s not in dispute as well. I would say. I absolutely have respect for that. I would like to see it occur. I would like to see every member be happy and felt that they heard and they were at home and so on and so forth. It’s all I’m saying is that it is a process. It’s not something that you turn on on day one. You have to go through a bonding process. We have to get to know each other. We have to go through our own frustrations and express them, which has just been done. So this is one session that is quite useful for that. And we’ve got into a very, you know, none of us muted. At the moment we’ve got into this very informal approach, which I think we need to have. However, when we’re in the middle of a design meeting session There are certain parameters which is helpful to stick to as you well know, Kona. You know, to have a facilitated that’s actually performing that function to have a recorder that’s actually performing that function. To help people aware of the protocols of a team so that if they’re not speaking, they’re muted so that they’re not interrupting other people’s sort processes and so on and so forth. You know, coming back with the retort straightaway as we do in normal conversation. Design between process is not a normal conversation. It’s a place where everybody gets an equal chance to state their views. And finish that statement and You know if a statement runs into more than 3 or 4 sentences people forget what you started saying so it’s important to keep a lot of common succinct. You can always follow up. You raise your hand. You can follow up with infinite comments if you want. But let’s get The first comment out there let people assimilate that. Respond if they think we need to respond. You see what I’m saying? So the thing is there’s certain. We can have this more informal conversation, which will be useful to. To other teams. But I think we’ve got to get past this and it’s a matter of how long is it going to take us. To get past this so we’re really working as a functional team. And we’ve, we’ve examined our own assumptions. Enough to know where we need further information. I mean in the future if we were discussing particular topics and I hope we will. The next question would be when we’re all happy. What expertise do we need in the room? I mean, if we’re trying to discuss it particular subject that we don’t have that expertise. Then it’s up to us as a team to say, is this someone that we can invite in? To bring these insects, you know, these insights into our deliberations. Just as an invited man, but not necessarily a permanent team member. You see what I’m saying? For certain things. This is the way I see teams developing. The core team of 5, 7, or 9 people. At the largest is remains a core team. It doesn’t chop and change all the time. The roles within it that would do. But but not the team itself otherwise you lose that continuity yes Martha.

Marthe
You’re muted.

Jacques
Thank you, Jeff. I was just wondering the The answers that Twon showed us. It probably should be put onto our schematic. No, I realize it would be too long. For me to put it on there now, because it will take a lot of time we don’t have that much time. But I imagine that that is the next step in our normal schematic. Is to put one’s different suggestions onto the piece of paper that we’re working on.

Jacques
Yeah, absolutely. I have everything that we say should at least be written down. It can be written down on another separate piece of paper and introduced in conversation. Hmm. You see what I mean? Not to cram it all onto that. Particular schematic and also there will be a lot of repetition I don’t doubt and there’ll be a lot of cross reference so ultimately we can go back in there and refine what we’ve got. But certainly we shouldn’t lose anything. You know, anything that’s salient and valid. Needs to be recorded and when we get on the Miro, I, I think we can all agree that we will be on Miro at some point, right? Does anybody think that Miro is not a good way to go? Here in no dissension, everybody wants to go on Miro, okay? So, yeah, end of discussion. I think it’s a matter of technically setting that up so that we’re able to do so. And training those members are not. Technically competent to get up to speed. And I hope that I hope that will, you know, proceed. Will have to be with a competent person so I would say to Jack Jack, would be a great guy to work with because he’s technically competent. As our Kona and, yourself, Marta probably. And of course, Juan and David with kids. So, I’m prepared to go there. We don’t have to We don’t have to sweat over the, the schematic is sitting there. It’s been sitting there for 15 years. It can sit there for another week. You know, the thing is, we’re coming to a consensus, we’re coming to. A meeting of minds as to where we want to go, which is the whole purpose. So. It’s a shame that we don’t have our other members here because you know B is always got a lot of input and I’m sure Jack will also have input on this. So I think if we can get to a point. As you say, Master, if you want to continue on in an informal manner, we can discuss. Some of our backgrounds, we think that’d be helpful. I’m happy to do that for the remaining 25 min myself. If we.

Marthe
Because we don’t have a consultant with us. Yes, mother.

Jacques
Absolutely, absolutely. This flows open. Can we ask David and Juan and Kona what? What they would like, how they’d like to. If anyone has any input David, would you like to say something more?

David
Bueno de entrada una disculpa jeff por haber distraído la conversación y haberla llevado al tema técnico Estoy de acuerdo en que ya está aprobado eso y creo que no hay más que decir al respecto a mí personalmente me gustaría dedicar estos 25 min que faltan solamente a conocernos un poco más Personalmente creo que eso es un punto fundamental en un equipo de diseño y eso hace que estemos más integrados precisamente por la empatía que vamos estableciendo los unos con los otros básicamente eso sería podríamos dedicarle 10 min aona 10 min a marta y 5 min para una hermosa oración y terminamos nuestra sesión del día de hoy.

Marthe
I, Perkino, Sinko, Akada, Uno, in, in the Los Baronis.

David
Ok está bien.

Marthe
Qué opinas con estás muy seria.

Jacques
Good. Could I get a brief? I think I understand. I think I understood a little bit of what he said, but could you be? Give me a brief, Martha.

Marthe
Oh, he was just saying that he thinks it’s really important to, get to know each other. Thanks, Jeff. I was just translating what David was saying.

Jacques
Yeah, sorry about that. I got a phone call. No, I think this is great stuff. Okay. I mean, I’ve always been an advocate of having. And I think it was even suggested if I’m mistaken, that we could have an informal meeting. The thing is we’re doing every week now, every Friday. As you know, most people have got work schedules. So it’s been quite full on. But actually we’re not getting apart from the first 4 or 5 min when we’re all being very social. Then it’s, to business stuff. So I feel that we’ve missed that. More informal reaction, informal discussions about some of these. I wanted to say something to Kona. About, well I’ve said it to you, Martha, in the past. About what I think. The 2 year. The 2 year curriculum. Means to me the thing is it’s gonna mean something slightly different, to everyone. It’s basically the information that’s being given to us is not Infinite. They want to train this up to be more spiritual people to be more considerate and more empathetic, more and so on and so forth. So it’s a spiritual training course really. Called the teaching mission and it’s it’s perpetual it runs all the time. So there’s certain websites that might be useful. I don’t want to necessarily advocate that. Because there are many, I don’t know where you’re gaining your information from. But the 1111 progress group. Is a very, very useful. Source of information on the teaching mission. ? It’s a constant flow of transcripts, very short and to the point. Teaching these basic points of of what it means to live a spiritual life. Some people think it’s so basic that it’s, not worth that time. But actually, It is because this is where you begin to realize, you get things in perspective. So I’ve been fortunate enough to be receiving these. These transcripts for more than 12 years. What I found is that After a certain length of time, funnily enough, which is close to 2 years. They tend to kind of repeat. I, there’s only so many concepts that they want us. To to actually assimilate and they’re very very good at continually hammering away at the same concept. And this is an important thing. So that’s how I understand it, that if you follow these things closely over a two-year period. If you get what I mean. You will get. That curriculum. Now, how you apply that curriculum? Is what the magisterial mission is all about. Is what these teams that are trying to. You know, to redesign social existence. Are all about. There’s no point in having people in those teams if they haven’t been. Spiritually educated up to a point where they can contribute. So that’s the difference. In my mind between the teaching mission as such and the magisterial mission. The one is for all individuals to raise their level. Their spiritual awareness and their They love of themselves really and they love of humanity. And the, the, is all about practical, pragmatic solutions about how we’re going to transform society over centuries. No. So very distinct. They’re the same, they’re coming from the same source. But, you know, that’s the difference. So as I see it, and as was stated in this last session. This team is really a part of the majesty or a mission. So it’s important to get that clear in your head. It’s not just another Teaching mission offshoot. It’s a majesty on a mission. It’s about trying to redesign. Social institutions. Across the world. For all people. Irrespective of their beliefs. Or their ethnicity or anything else. So that’s an important distinction for me. Did I see a hand go up then? Is that yours, Kona?

Kona
Okay.

Jacques
Yes, thank you for that. And just to slightly go back to what we were discussing before. Discussing assumptions and biases is too difficult then perhaps I’m going to ask What brings each of you the greatest joy? Me, it’s my cat, my lap, my grandchildren, coffee and chocolate. But. So would you just share with me and that we have left? What brings you the greatest joy perhaps?

Jacques
Yeah, well, let me begin as the, facilitator. This is really it. It’s, that, to have something to do. At this stage of my life, which is actually contributing. In a real way. To the correct in time. No, I’m I recognized by my peers for that? No. Do I care? No. In fact, In my view is too much to attract too much attention personally. In this is actually counterproductive. And that we serving a purpose and that is its own reward. So, yes, I used to have a cat and a dog and a wife and kids. They were they were the meaning of my life really. They’re no longer here. So I’ve reached the point in my life where it’s very important that I haven’t completely wasted. The training and the effort that’s been put in. To getting me into this position. And then not perform. So my joy is to give everything I’ve got in this effort. And not to hold anything back and more importantly not to have any personal expectations. Coming out of it. Not looking for accolades. That’s me.

Kona
You’ve shared a lot more of yourself than just your joy and I greatly appreciate you sharing your perspective.

Jacques
Forma. Anybody else? Martha. You’re muted, Martha, David.

Marthe
Yeah. Okay, I was hoping the men will go first and okay, I will go my greatest joy. I love being me. I love my life. I love the work I do. It gives me enormous joy. I love my son who’s 14 years old and every second spent with him gives me great joy. And my passion is governance for the growth of souls. My greatest joy would be to live in a country. Where we have found the structures. To allow for people’s sole growth. And maybe the last bit of my joy is would give me great joy to be very lean and to have as much time as possible to do exercise to walk along this beautiful promenade of where I live. I live in one of the most beautiful places in the world, I think. And seeing. Smelling puppies there’s nothing like the smell of the breaths of puppies. Yeah. So my my place of joy would be me lying under a little tent like I did when I was 5 years old with little puppies smitting like cereal chord pro-neutro. That would give me great joy and seeing whales. Gives me great joy. So yes.

Jacques
Okay. What you mean the ones that you mean the ones that swim about?

Marthe
Yeah. Yes, the very large ones that swim about. But, yes, I would like the largest joy would be me being very lean walking along the promenade looking at whales and feeling fulfilled that I’ve used my talents. Overcome my many, many shortcomings. And and see around me a worlds that is governed for the growth of souls. That’s me. Thank you.

David
Yo te. Que yo te.

Jacques
Lovely. Could, could you put that into Spanish for the benefit of our Spanish speakers, in in brief just let’s get it right down to You understand it? I’m not, do you think? To, perfect. And those is no, okay, I said.

David
Perfect. Okay, okay, okay. Pero a. Además ya te conocemos marta.

Jacques
See, okay. Yeah. One, David. Any inputs?

Marthe
Yes, one. Hmm. Hmm.

Juan
Que lo que más me gusta y me da alegría es servir a lo que estamos haciendo es mi única razón de estar acá no tengo otra me gusta la naturaleza las personas aunque sean desagradables tengo cariño de toda manera y creo que lo que estamos haciendo aquí lo que yo hago aquí es mucho más importante y glorioso porque otra cosa que haya hecho y estar con ustedes aquí me con mucha alegría Porque sé que somos somos pocos pero a la vez somos muchos. Hmm. Hmm. Que queremos hacer este trabajo con amor con sin ninguna intención de lujo ningún interés estamos aquí porque queremos servir al tiempo de corrección Eso me da alegría. Hmm. Gracias.

Jacques
Yeah. Okay. David, please, a little sentence or 2.

Marthe
Yeah Many.

David
Hello. Amo b los ojos de mi padre celestial observándome en la madrugada cuando yo despierto. Hmm. Y diciéndome te estoy esperando amo ese de comunión con mi espíritu. Hmm. Hmm. Donde todo está en silencio y donde siento su presencia abrazándome diciéndome cuánto me ama a eso amo caminar en la playa con mi novia. Amo tomar café en las mañanas y entre las cosas que más amo están ustedes créanme yo los amo. Esto es yo realmente los amo los quiero mucho y quiero que lo sepan que lo sientan otra cosa que amo mucho es hacer este trabajo maravilloso esto es lo más importante para mí servir a mikael. Hmm. Servir a mikael y a mi amado príncipe maqui venta amo eso este es el motivo de mi vida el motivo supremo Estoy muy feliz de estar con ustedes Aunque a veces me sienta un poquito frustrado por el idioma. Yeah. Eso es.

Marthe
Youutiful. Hmm.

Jacques
Thank you so much. I know so much more about. Yes, how lovely. We just, Yeah. So it’s pretty exceptional group of people. I think we can agree. And the one thing we all share is, a complete lack of any self aggrandizement I think. Hmm. We none of us looking for. A medal or anything because as David was saying That relationship is in our hearts, is it not? And it’s direct and it’s unique. To each of us. So, pretty special thing. So we’ve kind of, we’ve all come up with a spirituality here. I would like a discussion at some point in the group as to. Yeah, what and who we’re trying to reach. And kind of like an examination of What do we think? That what we say, how does that affect other people? How is that going to influence? Others that might come to these. To this dialogue later. So for me That’s massive privately. Yeah, I could talk about. Price micel and Mac events and spirituality all day long. But I have noticed that. Not an awful lot of interest in that in the general population. So. Rather than Do that and find myself. Outside of. That’s sort of social interaction. I’ve decided to. Keep that to myself. In my private moments. And to simply try and be as effective as I can be to help the people that are around me. No. Whatever they believe. So I don’t approach people saying. I’m not going to help you if you don’t believe in Christ Michael. You know, that would be counterproductive as I see it. So our own personal spirituality, I think, is something that’s obviously. Of paramount importance to all of us. But it’s how that impacts upon the work of this team. I think we need to, need to be aware of. And. Not that I’m suggesting that people should hide their spirituality. But that it’s that we’re aiming at all people that we’re not. We’re, we’re about inclusivity. We’re not a boat. Special groups all. Elites or anything else. Because, our work is going to reach. Everyone, I would like to think that anyone could come. And learn from this. And not get repelled perhaps by something that they’re not familiar with. So most of what we talk about is fairly. It’s hard to dispute it. I mean, these things are so, it’s been said before, the 7 values are self evident. The self-evident. You know, everybody contains these values. 2 a greater or less extent and they have their own interpretations of those values. That’s just a given. That’s happening in every human being on the planet. Also, I think we forget sometimes now that we are talking about spirituality. But the father himself lives. How has a presence within each Each of us. No, it’s not under any confusion about what’s going on here. Is constantly interacting with our. Conscious brains if you will But it’s in such a way that, you know, some of us are not able to. To verify that in experience, should we say, I mean, Martha, I think, aren’t you working with Chris Morris?

Marthe
I’m click contact.

Jacques
On his, conscious. Conscious. What is it? Contact so these are things this isn’t this is an example of a teaching mission for me. This is an example of how individually we can elevate our spirituality and our understanding. But is it relevant to this team? To make that public. You see what I’m saying?

Marthe
Yes, Martha.

Jacques
I just wanted to mention something that happened to me last night. In response to what you’re saying. Hmm. I’ve been doing the conscious contact practice with with Chris and with Marty for probably more than a year and I mean I’ve been writing down. Messages from Akiventa and others for more than 1012 years. But doing it the way that Chris Morris received it over the 13 lessons has only been in the last year or so and I try and do it every day. I don’t always succeed. My time is very limited because I goes on. Before 6 and you know after 9 sometimes, but something very interesting happened last night. I had guests here, they both came for supper. My son went to bed, I went to bed, and suddenly I heard myself screaming. And in front of me had appeared. Being. And it didn’t, I, my first thought was, and my son immediately was there. And the moment was gone. But in front of me appeared. Something. That was very clear in that moment, but it disappeared in 1 s because obviously I had screamed with a surprise on the and my son was with me and and the moment had gone. But, really interesting. And it’s something I want to take.

Jacques
That’s wonderful. That’s wonderful. Well, it’s not only interesting. I mean, Yeah, it’s not only interesting. It’s probably quite significant. I mean, Better in mind what we’re involved with at some point quite soon I sent although I don’t know Daniel is simply going to remove himself from this process. And it’ll be the usual talk, which also took place in C time. If you remember, or prior to CTAG. In the PMG transcripts where it was said. Well, this one is going to be reassigned and Maybe that another maybe another TR will step up. And lo and behold. John Morris came into prominence and is now The TR for Mission. No. You are about as close as it comes to conscious contact for this team, Martha. So you might want to think about that. I certainly don’t possess that ability. I don’t feel that we absolutely need it because we’ve already had the training that these teams can operate as Conan is doing. Yeah. Yeah. These teams can operate anywhere. In business. You know, and as a follow-up to what you said earlier, it’s a real shame that Stefan. Hmm. Hmm. Apparently no longer is able to be with us because he’s been absolutely wonderful over the years and is already gone into all of these questions in past transcripts. And he is actively working within his own corporation and business to try to transform it from the inside out. So it’d be very interesting to see how he’s doing that. Also, Martha’s mentioned, I don’t know his last name, but there was another one in Colombia. Yeah. A while back that had try to implement a family learning center.

Marthe
He continues to, yeah.

Jacques
Well, I would love to hear what problems he’s encountering, what lessons he’s learned in that process. So we might incorporate it into our own designs. So these are things which I feel in the future as we. Gel as a team. That these things will endoubtedly come out that people will come over the woodwork that you’ll find that when we start talking about politics. That Mr. Craig Carmichael might suddenly be interested again. This sort of thing, who knows how it’s going to unfold at the moment we’re trying to hold together a team which Yeah. I was committed to this process over. A period of time. And it’s I think it’s important that we prove that we can do that. And we can do it effectively and we can do it. Bye, collaborating together. Yes, Conan.

Kona
But it would it would also be helpful for me to know I don’t know how long you have been meeting with Daniel in this perspective or if this group grew out of CTAG or how it came to be. But a brief history would be helpful since I’m relatively new because I’ve wondered about the connection with what’s now Mission. I think CTAG has been around for a while, but if you, if you have. Okay.

Jacques
Well, I’m glad you brought it up. I know it’s one of talking we’ve been on for 2 h, so I don’t want to take up everybody’s time. Yeah, no, we’re already over the, but let me give you a brief. Let me give my own view part on that. I’ve been involved in the process since it’s initiation really. 2,008. Where Daniel started to Channel Mon. Initially who It’s as well to remember is actually. Is actually the point of issuance really of the majesty of mission. So there were many, many voluminous transcripts, some of 180 pages long. You know, laying out all of what was to come in the future, telling it like it is and so on. Then a lot of people course. We all overreacted, we thought, oh. It’s great. It’s gonna be a new dispensation, you know. All of our prayers are going to be answered. And, and is going to appear anytime now. You might even show up at my house. And it affected people’s minds to the extent that they had to go through a period then of 4, 5 or even more years or almost a decade where they gradually their expectations were shot out of the sky. That they had to face their own disappointments. They had to face their own impositions of what they thought ought to be happening. And question after question has been fired at Monteronts and the Mac event. You know, countless transcripts on this. But eventually a core of people stuck around. And that developed into, It was compensated with Mon. And then it became new era conversations. Where it wasn’t necessarily with Mon. It was more with now, Michael Venter, who is taken over as the veritable headmaster really. Master of ceremonies, if you will. And also Sanjay. Whose expertise is in team development. Many, many, many transcripts, Kona. As to how that should be done. They’re out there, but they’re not on everybody’s lips or fingertips. You know, and that’s problematic for me. Hence the importance of what David and Juan are talking about. To organize this material. To find a searchable database. That you can punch in. Healthcare. How’s in health care? Education. And get all of the information that already exists. Obviously, it’s a tedious process. We’re trying to do that manually, so it would involve AI and so on and so forth. And this has been talked about for years, in years. So that will happen. It’s happening now. It’s just that because we only live for 80 years. And some of us are already at the end of that. Continuum. It seems like there’s nothing happening. It seems like the walking in treacle all the time that we’re not making headway. But in actual fact, we are. We are just going through just examining it just dealing with our own disappointments. And realizing, you know, I need to go at my launches, not going to be, I’m not going to get out of it what I thought it was going to get out of bit but you know what I’m not walking away. Because I’m here to serve. Everyone else, I’m not here to serve my own. Particular viewpoint. So I think this is the process. And we’re well involved in it and I hope it will long continue. So, that was a very informal discussion at the end of that. I don’t know how that’s going to come out. In the editing and everything. One thing I would say. B is not here today, so I don’t want to say anything that you can’t defend. But I think making these videos in their entirety public. Too early would be a mistake. I mean, I think, they ought to be collected together. If we’re going to put them out into the public sphere, in my mind they should be edited to to an extent where If we do come up with something that’s problematic or is not considered to be helpful, then that can be edited out. Yes, Conan.

Kona
Yeah, I have heard that and I understand that some of the trauma that many of you have experienced over the many decades. The teaching mission and magisterial mission. From my perspective is a little bit different and I’ll and I’ll I’ll give it some context kind of like David’s gave the example of cleaning his bathroom. I came out as bisexual very late in life. At 42. I, I didn’t know what I didn’t know. My parent, my parents did not tell me. About a sex assignment surgery that I had had as a child. And so when I came out at 42 and my mom tells me it explained a whole lot about my life. Well, I Live my life, open as a heterosexual. As a cisgender female for 42 years. And when I found out the truth about myself, I was unwilling to go back in the closet. As so many people have had to live in the closets. I could be the voice that says. It’s okay for you to be yourself. And I can be the bridge between 2 worlds, the heterosexual world and the clear world. Because I’ve had so much kind of like Moses was raised in Egypt. He’s an Israeli raised agent. He had the voice of a king. I have the voice of a heterosexual person and I have 30 years in the church. So I can be that place in the gap. My thought is, is that if you keep on. Hmm. Subverting or hiding your message. Nobody is going to hear it. It needs to be heard so that it becomes a household language. The time now is for it to be a household language is common. As the Bible or Christianity, you know, to understand who Jesus really is. And so I would encourage you and this is come through and in and Mac, Ventus message. For us to be assertive, right? Yeah. The speaking of which, I’m gonna be assertive now. With 10 min over the 2 HI have to leave because I have someone coming Is all of this recorded David?

David
Todo está.

PostedMay 31, 2026

UpdatedMay 31, 2026

ByJuan Ramirez

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